Pilot, with Raylene Meunier, Fly on the Wall Productions

Honestly, this pilot is pretty sad, not because of content but because I hadn't learned to use the Open Broadcast Studio software to include my guest's video or audio yet. But here it is. This is the only episode so far that I recorded in the Fly on the Wall studios in Barre, which we did on July 6, 2023. Before I could record another, the floods hit, and I've been figuring out the plan for moving forward. For now, I'm recording at home and hosting it here.

"No Place Like Home" is a podcast about missing pets. I feature content from owners, finders, volunteers, and professionals.

I always appreciate a rating and review on your podcast app and a follow on Facebook, where you can find the show at nplhmitch. Find episodes, transcripts, and additional information at noplacelikehome.show.

If you have questions or feedback, you can contact me at nplhmitch@gmail.com.

Remember to always think missing, not stray or dumped.

This podcast was created, hosted, recorded, and produced by me, Mitch Bernard. The opinions expressed on this show are those of the people expressing them and do not necessarily represent the views of any other entity.

Transcript

Mitch Bernard (00:00):
Please check your recording path under settings. Output recording.

Raylene Meunier (00:03):
Oh, that you can X out. We're not recording. Okay. 'cause we don't want,

Mitch Bernard (00:07):
All right. So we're gonna, um, we're, we started, started streaming. Hi. So I'm gonna hit transition JD there. I'm <laugh>. All right. Did I do everything? You can't tell 'cause you're not over here to see me. But, um, I'm talking to Ray Lean Ye, who's the producer here. Um, but you don't know yet who I am. Welcome to No Place like Home, A new podcast about missing pets. Uh, we are broadcasting. That's old fashioned. Oh, I didn't even transition over here. Oh, right. And then window, right. <laugh>. First day learning curve. You're so backlit there. We need to get some good lights on you. Yeah,

Raylene Meunier (01:05):
Yeah. It happens when it's

Mitch Bernard (01:07):
This, when it's sunny out. It's very sunny and very hot. Yes. It's all right. Well, let me try my little intro again. This is my first day. So welcome to No Place Like Home, a podcast about missing pets. We are, um,

(01:23):
Recording live, uh, from aired out podcasts at the Fly on the Wall production studios in, uh, on beautiful Mountain Main Street in downtown Berry, Vermont. Yay. Yeah. All right. That was the hard part, right? <laugh>, that was the hard part. Had to, you know, get all that stuff right. So, I wanna tell you today a little bit about the podcast, and I'm here with Ralene Ye, who is the producer here. And, um, we're gonna just chat about the new podcast, talk a little bit about me and my background, and why I have the podcast. And, um, today we'll not be taking questions, but, uh, usually we will, can,

Raylene Meunier (02:04):
If you want to, because I, I

Mitch Bernard (02:06):
Can see we Oh. 'cause you have your, oh, okay. Disregard that last comment. If you'd like to post any comments can totally do it. Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So, Raylene's gonna tell me, um, if we get any, any questions. And one of the things that I'm hoping will happen with this podcast is that we will be able to, um, have people actually submit their own questions about their missing pets, or if they find a pet, what do they do with it? So, um, I'm hoping that that will be an engaging way for people to communicate with us during podcast, even when we have guests, which we will most of the time, I think. Um, so I wanna thank you for helping me get this off the ground here. I am new to Barry, new to Vermont. I moved here in March from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and, um, used to have a podcast there called Pittsburgh Tales.

(02:57):
And it was all about, um, animals more generally. But, um, when I moved here, I decided that I really wanted to focus on missing pets, because that is an area in which I have some training and experience. Um, everybody has pets almost, I think statistically, like almost every household has pets. And, uh, I don't think I know anybody who's never had one go missing for a little while. So, and it'll give you a panic. It is really, yeah. Very frighten. It's one of the worst feelings, you know, uh, I, I dunno how people with actual human children go through that, because it's just wrenching when it's just a cat, you know, or just a dog. But, um, uh, I used to see these, uh, notices on social media about my cat is missing, my dog is missing. Um, and alternatively see them about, um, found animals.

(03:50):
I, you know, there's a cat that's been showing up in my yard for the past week. What do I do with it? And, uh, it just would break my heart to think about these families that didn't have their pets with them and worry about the pets and what's ki what's happening to them. So I took some training from an organization called, um, missing Animal Response Network, and I'll post links to everything, um, after, after the show. But, um, this network was started by a woman named Kat Albrecht, who was a police officer years ago in California. And she, um, had been doing canine work with her own bloodhound to, um, detect people, find people fugitives and things like that. And she, um, really wanted to do this with missing pets. And the conventional wisdom was, it just doesn't work with pets. You know, dogs that find people can't be taught to find pets, because if you're training a pet to find a person, one of the things that you have to teach it is don't pay attention to all these distractions.

(04:51):
Um, but she found that it's possible, completely possible to train them to look for specific animals by picking up a scent article from the owner, um, you know, a brush or a bed or something like that, that has the animal scent on it, or they can be taught to, um, detect any cat, for instance. So, um, anyway, the, the course was, um, 10 weeks long, and I learned so much and have been helping people for the past couple of years recover mostly cats, but I also work on dog cases. And, um, I'm very excited to try to, um, help out with the efforts that are already underway in Vermont. I've

Raylene Meunier (05:33):
Seen you on social media try to help people get their pets back

Mitch Bernard (05:37):
At the store. Yeah. Um,

Raylene Meunier (05:40):
And it's actually, I guess I never thought that there were really methods to doing it Yeah. Before, and, and there really are, there are certain ways that you should do it. And

Mitch Bernard (05:54):
Yeah. And the ways that you think you should do them are almost never the way you think that you should. Uh, I almost call the podcast, ignore Your Instincts, because, um, the, you know, the first thing you think of is call the pet. 'cause when the pet is home and you want it, you call it and it comes or it doesn't come, but you know, you're sort of used to the behavior and that's what your instinct is, call it, go look for it. And, um, those are almost always counterproductive. Um, when, we're gonna talk a lot about this on the podcast, but one of the things that happens when a pet is displaced, which is anything, we consider that anything outside of their normal territory. So an indoor only cat, any place outside the house, um, a cat with indoor outdoor access, uh, that territory could be very broad depending on how far they wander, um, during the day when they're out.

(06:47):
So, when they're out of their normal territory, they're displaced and they are in prey mode. They, any, pretty much any pet is gonna go into a prey mode where they are afraid of everything, and their only goal is to not be found, not be discovered. And so even if they hear their owner and they see their owner, um, they will not come. They will hide. Um, if, you know, people talk a lot about sending out search parties and people wanna help, neighbors wanna help, and they come out and say, oh, I'm gonna, that's our nature. Yes. We wanna, you know, we're gonna do a search party on Saturday, you know, everybody come meet at, you know, the park, and, um, and we're gonna go look for this missing dog. And the thing is that what can happen very easily is that the dog will be afraid, feel hunted and pursued, and will move farther and farther away, trying to escape this, the proximity of trying to put distance between them and the search party.

(07:47):
So there are a lot of techniques that are proven and, um, we learn them in the network. And, um, the good news is that there are some really good resources here in Vermont that I'm finding already, um, still learning the landscape a little bit. But there's, um, there are some Facebook groups and pages that, um, post missing pets and pretty regularly, and they post updates when pets are found. Um, if you're lucky, they also post how the pet was recovered because we learned so much from those kinds of cases. Um, and there are some people both, um, organized, you know, with like their own organizations and independently who will help you. They will lend traps and cameras. They will come and teach you how to, you know, do whatever it is that you need to do. Um, Sue Ware is one of the people I've found first when I moved here, and you'll see her on Facebook. Um, super helpful. And these people give out advice, and the people who follow it will often have, they will certainly have more intentional success than people who don't follow that advice, which is another thing that we'll talk about <laugh>.

Raylene Meunier (09:03):
So you are probably very much pro chipping.

Mitch Bernard (09:09):
Yes, absolutely. I am pro neuter and spay as young as you and your vet will agree to it. Um, you know, there are some medical cases where it's not appropriate for the animal, but many, most animals, most pets should be, um, desexed and microchipped because it makes, um, it makes returning them to a finder to, to an owner so much easier. Um, another thing that I have found to be better here than it was in Pittsburgh is, um, that there does seem to be a level of public confidence in the shelter system and animal control. Um, in Pittsburgh, what they had was, um, the, the governance is set up very much like here, where there's a county, there's towns and townships, there's cities and boroughs and villages and all the little tiny municipalities, um, where there could be, you know, a hundred of them in a pretty small geographic space.

(10:08):
But in Western Pennsylvania, every municipality contracts its own animal control. So, um, some animal control officers are great and try really hard to get the pets back, and some are really awful. And so what you see on social media down there is as soon as you post that you found an animal, there will be panicked comments on the post saying, whatever you do, don't take that pet to, you know, the shelter because, um, the, and then they'll throw out some horrible story about an animal getting put down before it's family could get to them. Or, you know, did it without a stray hold, did it without, um, you know, reason. The pet was perfectly healthy. We had rescue rudder to take it. You know, you never know how accurate those stories are, but the fact is that there's a very low level of public confidence in the shelter systems there. And it's been really nice to see that that doesn't happen here. Um, what happens here is the way it's supposed to work, which is if I find an animal, I take it to the shelter, and the shelter helps, you know, try to find the, find the owner. And if they don't, then they, you know, proceed from there. But, uh, and if I'm an owner with a missing pet, I go to the shelter and I look to see what they've got. For the most

Raylene Meunier (11:27):
Part here in Vermont, I think most shelters are, if the owner isn't found that they go up for adoption. Right. I'm not sure that, do we have kill shelter?

Mitch Bernard (11:39):
We're gonna talk a lot about that terminology. Um, there's, in my opinion, there's no such thing as a kill shelter. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> it, if it's a kill facility, it might be a pound, an impoundment, um, something like that. But, um, shelters are shelters and some, um, you know, there's a lot of controversy about the no kill movement and the no kill label, because every shelter, if it has a sick or dying animal, or an animal with, um, unadoptable behaviors, is gonna euthanize that animal. They just are. You can't, I mean, I guess there's an alternative of warehousing the animal mm-hmm. <affirmative> for the rest of its natural life in a kennel. Horrible. Which is not, in my opinion, horrible. Yeah. In my opinion, that's not mm-hmm. A great system. Um, so the, the shelters that, um, in general, this is my experience, my opinion, uh, shelters or facilities that call themselves no kill, do not take in animals that they are not certain they can adopt out mm-hmm.

(12:45):
<affirmative>. So they're not gonna take the senior medical, you know, whatever the behavior issues, the, the difficult to adopt animals unless they have a lot of space. Um, but if there's, you know, at all short on space, they're just gonna take in as many animals as they know they can find homes for in a reasonable amount of time. That's not, what that does is shift the burden to all the other surrounding organizations. Um, which I mean, all of everyone who's rescuing animals, thank you for doing what you do. Thank you for doing what you do, <laugh> mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But it's, um, it's, uh, created a false sense of superiority in the community between the two kinds of facilities, public shelters that have open intake or managed intake where you can take your pet there or a found animal there and know that they will take it from you is really a great service.

(13:40):
Even if the only thing they can do sometimes is euthanize that animal because the animal has to go somewhere. And if you can't keep it and you can't find somebody to take it, I mean, it has to go somewhere. And I don't like that that's the case. We are not gonna adopt our way out of pet overpopulation. It just isn't gonna happen. Um, so that's a very sad situation. But, um, yeah, so whether we have, um, high kill rates is just not a question I know the answer to, and probably nobody really knows the answer because data about that are really scarce. There's no uniform, um, database repository. Um, people have tried to implement that. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, there are a couple of organ organizations that have, um, data that they've collected, but all the data that they receive are voluntary vol voluntarily sent, and they're not uniform.

(14:39):
So, um, for instance, a shelter might advertise that it has a 96% live release rate. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, 97, 90 6% of the animals that it brings in go out alive. What you don't know is whether that really does include every animal that's presented to them, or if they've already subtracted out the unadoptable animals and they're now just counting the active population of animals in their shelter, that 96% of those that were in originally taken in as adoptable get adopted out, and only 4% get put to sleep. So it's, it's really hard to, to get good data on that stuff. Um, so I don't know the answer, but what I'm looking forward to is talking to people from the local organizations, rescues and shelters, and the individuals who do, um, recovery work to, um, find out whatever we can about the different organizations and different resources that are available to people.

(15:34):
Um, but like I said, the good news is that the systems here seem to be working well in terms of, you know, public confidence and willingness to use the system the way it's supposed to be used. That makes me happy, <laugh>. Yeah, absolutely. So, um, so what we're gonna do on the podcast is talk about all of these kinds of resources and organizations and individuals will have lots of interviews, um, but also how you as a pet owner can best use your energy in the first day, second day, and the days thereafter to get your pet home. Um, no matter how long it takes, and, you know, we tell people it's a marathon, not a sprint. Your animal might come home in 45 minutes, but your animal might not come home for 45 days. Might be even longer than that. We've got pets missing for months and even years sometimes.

(16:27):
And you can't sustain the same level of emotional and physical energy in your search and recovery efforts for that kind of period of time. So I like to coach people in terms of, um, the phases of recovery. You know, what's most important to do, the very minute you realize that they're missing and into that first 24 hours. And then what is important to do next after that, and then after that sort of sustained model. And, um, when do you, how do you decide when it's time to sort of step back your efforts? If you've been setting a trap every day, you know, do you stop? You know, how do you know when to stop doing that? It's a very hard, um, place for an owner to be because you never want to give up. And, um, some pets really don't ever get recovered. Most do, I think, um, who go through this process.

(17:18):
I will not say most do, period. 'cause I don't think that's true. And, um, in other locations, the rate of reunite, reunification with a family is pretty low, especially for cats, um, who go into, you know, a shelter system. They're very often not ever recovered and, um, given or not ever reunited and adopted out to new families. So, um, you know, I wanna try to help teach people about what they can do, um, if they are missing a pet. And also, of course, on the other end, what to do if you find an animal, which, um, we do get a lot of those, especially about cats. But we do get those about dogs on these, these, uh, Facebook pages too. So that's what I wanna do. And, um, we are gonna have guests, uh, next week I have, um, Carmen Brothers, who has been a great mentor to me and a friend.

(18:13):
She, um, so when I was in the middle of this self-paced course, I say I was in the middle of, I was not really in the middle of it. Um, really, it's a 10 week course, and I was stuck at module one for like a year and a half. I enrolled in the course self-paced, and I was like, okay, I'm gonna do this in my spare time, and I am, you know, the project of the month girl. So I just didn't, I, I got into the extensive reading list and videos and all of that, and then just didn't get any farther. And then my cat went missing, and I thought I was gonna lose my mind, but I knew that there was this system, that there was this network. And, um, so I did the things that they were telling me to do on the website.

(19:00):
The, the network website has fantastic instructions, what to do. It has, um, pages about like lost cat behavior studies that they've done, um, and plenty of instructions for what to do. It also has a directory of, um, people who've been through the same training that I have. And some of them, many of them also train their dogs to go out and track animals, trail animals. So that's what I wanted, um, was someone to come and do that. So I found the only person in the directory who would come to Pittsburgh, and that was Carmen. And so she came up and she helped me a lot. And during the whole search, she kept saying, Mitch, you've got to join, you know, get engaged in the, the scheduled class so that you actually finish this because you can help people now that you've been through it especially.

(19:52):
So I did do that, and I finally finished, but she, um, has, she came up several times to Pittsburgh to help other, you know, cases I was working on. And, um, you know, through the network, the members, um, and graduates have different Facebook groups, and we all kind of support each other and help each other, brainstorm, brainstorm cases. So, um, we're in touch there too. But, um, the podcast is not about the network. It's not sponsored by the network. It's just me. But, um, but I will talk about, um, some of the work that we do because it is a really great resource. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, so one of the resources around here that does, um, a lot of, uh, proactive work is Granite State Dog Recovery, canine Recovery. Yeah.

Raylene Meunier (20:39):
I, I see their Granite State listings a lot.

Mitch Bernard (20:42):
Yeah. Their, um, and Central Vermont Canine Recovery, um, is also an organization that of course covers our area. And they say that they follow the methods, um, of Granite State. And, um, it, those methods are a little different from the networks, but they're very, very good and they seem to be very effective. They, um, I hope that we'll be able to get someone from the, from each of those organizations on the podcast. But, um, my understanding is that they, um, prefer because of this tendency of, um, displaced pets to, um, flee, to try to separate themselves from search parties and search dogs and all of all of that. They really prefer to focus on a passive approach where, um, they put up a lot of signs and things so that people in the community are aware, but they, um, you'll always see on the signs they say, don't call, don't pursue.

(21:36):
Right. Don't approach, don't chase. Um, instead text this number, call this number. And, um, so what they do is they use that to create kind of a map of where that animal has been seen and then they can target, um, where the best place is to set up a feeding station and a trap. And we'll talk about all of those things too. But, um, it's, uh, it's a lit, it's not so focused on the tracking dog, um, or, you know, search parties and things like that, um, that a lot of people do. Um, and one of the cautions that we'll talk about as well is there are a lot of charlatans out there who will take advantage of and really be very cruel to, um, pet owners who are going, who are in an extremely vulnerable time. You know, your, your precious pet is gone and you will, you know, someone calls you and says, oh, you know, I can, or you see a post on Instagram from somebody saying, you know, oh, well, we recover pets, and they have some video of them, you know, them recovering a pet. And, um, you contact them and you think, okay, you know, I'm gonna send them a thousand dollars and they're gonna come out and they're gonna look for my pet. And the thing is that it takes a lot of skill and experience to know when that pet is, uh, when that tracking dog, for instance, is actually on the track. Some dogs just love to run and sniff, and the, the unscrupulous handler can tell you people wanna

Raylene Meunier (23:11):
Just take your money and never help you

Mitch Bernard (23:12):
At all. Yeah. Some people will take the money and never show up. Um, that is Yeah. Just as bad. But, um, but anyway, so we'll talk about ways to be sure that you're working with someone who is legit. And, um, so that if you do bring somebody out, you're not, uh, you're not getting bad information. 'cause it's all just about collecting as much data as you can so you can figure out where to set that trap. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So, um, or where to lure it from. And we'll talk about some methods for that too. So, um,

Raylene Meunier (23:48):
Sounds like you're gonna have a lot of things to unpack as you go

Mitch Bernard (23:53):
Through. Yeah. The episode

Raylene Meunier (23:55):
Of just how detailed it actually is when Yeah. You know, when you first hear about, you know, we're gonna do a podcast about missing pets, I think you think, okay, how can we

Mitch Bernard (24:08):
Continually

Raylene Meunier (24:08):
Yeah. Do that? But there's a lot of information, there's a lot of methods, there's a lot of information. And as you said, you can learn from each other. And the

Mitch Bernard (24:17):
<crosstalk> definitely.

Raylene Meunier (24:18):
And so it it, the stories of someone else that may have lost their pet and may

Mitch Bernard (24:25):
Absolutely

Raylene Meunier (24:25):
Somebody else recover

Mitch Bernard (24:27):
Theirs. I always wanna know how they got the pet back when I, when I see those reuni reunification posts, um, you know, I hope that the owner will take a minute to just, you know, did, did you just see them out and you walked up and they came to you mm-hmm. <affirmative>, which does happen, it's not common mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, but with, you know, like super well socialized pets who aren't very far from home, that does happen. Um, yeah, we definitely wanna know, and there is so much to, uh, talk about with regard to this more than just individual cases, but I do definitely want to, um, talk about individual cases. Um, today I saw, um, a missing cat case, uh, that was very typical of what we see on the Facebook pages where, you know, there's a beautiful picture of this cat and the person says, you know, my cat got out on July 3rd or July 4th, and of course this time of year is so scary because people know that their pets are, can be terrified out there.

(25:28):
Um, and there's kind of this panic to get them back. This is the busiest time of year for people who do this kind of work, um, professionally or voluntarily. And, um, so anyway, this, um, cat this morning, um, that I saw, uh, the, the owner gave some very helpful information that the cat is indoor only doesn't have any outdoor access. What does that tell me? It tells me that the cat is probably very close to home, if not back inside the house. Yeah. Hunkered down under a porch or a deck or in a shed or in the bushes somewhere very close. We find that cats that don't have outdoor access tend to stay within about three to five houses radius from home. Um, and that range can depend on their personality, like if they're very outgoing or if they're the kind of cat that hides when company comes.

(26:21):
Um, but it can also depend on the other animals in the area or their dogs that might have chased it away or other cats. You know, if you're in a, um, an area that has a very, um, active feral colony that doesn't welcome outsiders, which a lot do, but some don't, um, you know, did the cat have to go to find or traffic, you know, cat, uh, I worked on a case in Pittsburgh where there was a cat in a city neighborhood that, um, crossed a busy, busy throughway in town, but at one 30 in the morning, so there was no traffic. And then the question was how do we, you know, work? Like we had to make a decision about exactly where to focus our search efforts because we weren't sure how the cat would ever get back across the street. And you don't wanna lure them across the street if they have, you know, back across the street if they haven't already gotten there.

(27:13):
And it's amazing. Um, what's, how far some pets will go, some very small pets. I saw a case yesterday, I can't remember whether it was a local case or not, but a little tiny, like six pound chihuahua had made it like four miles from home before they found it. And it was, but this is all the importance of posters and the flyers, and we're gonna talk about the difference between those two and the importance of them. But, um, yeah, it's all about making sure, so my general approach in, in addition to that kind of three phase timeframe is, um, making sure that anyone who sees the pet or might see the pet or hear it or find evidence of it, uh, knows that it's an owned pet and that it's missing, um, that it's missing and that it's missed. That there's someone who wants this pet back, it wasn't dumped.

(28:01):
Um, and that's the first thing. And so social media, but also door to door, you know, flyers requesting to search the property is very helpful early on, especially with cats that might be very good at hiding. Um, and, uh, posters on roads, so very large like neon posters. Um, and then the second branch of that is attempting to locate the pet directly. And that's where you get cameras and you start doing your maps like, um, central Vermont Canine Recovery does, um, to sort of pinpoint where mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And then once you've located the pet through either of those avenues, then you start, um, putting together a trapping plan. And the traps are not like the bear traps on Bugs Bunny <laugh>. They are, they are, um, box traps usually, which are, um, humane traps. You put bait inside, it's a big cage and the animal just goes in and it slams shut on them.

(29:00):
And there's, it's hard to watch them on camera, be very scared that they're, you know, suddenly enclosed because they've been on the run for a while. But, um, you just remind yourself that they're gonna be much happier in a little while. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So, so that is what the podcast is gonna be about. And um, I am looking forward to having lots of guests on. Uh, and, um, like I said, next week is Carmen Brothers. She just got married and I haven't asked her yet whether she's using Carmen Brothers Butler or, anyway, Carmen, uh, my friend and mentor will be on. Um, but in the meantime, I wanna thank aired out and fly on the wall productions and especially you Ralene Yay you for everything you've done. I can't wait. It's super helpful to sit

Raylene Meunier (29:44):
JD as well.

Mitch Bernard (29:45):
Oh yeah, that'll be great. Um,

Raylene Meunier (29:47):
You know, it's, um, good to have you and we're looking forward to it, and I'm actually pretty interested to know just what all of this is about.

Mitch Bernard (29:59):
Cool.

Raylene Meunier (30:00):
So I'm looking forward to that.

Mitch Bernard (30:01):
Yeah. The good news is you can tune in for free <laugh>, you can tune in.

Raylene Meunier (30:05):
Yeah. And, um, and please do. And, and please, um, it, we're gonna, we're calling you Mitch.

Mitch Bernard (30:11):
Yes.

Raylene Meunier (30:12):
Yes. That's, that's your preferable. Yeah. Um,

Mitch Bernard (30:15):
So pronouns are she her? Yeah. Mitch is a nickname. Right. You're

Raylene Meunier (30:18):
A snitch. And so we can do, um, questions in the meantime. Yeah. You have a Facebook page, no place like home. Yep. And so if, if there's something that you wanna ask in the meantime, people can reach out to you at any time. And, um,

Mitch Bernard (30:36):
And if you're not on Facebook, I do have an email address, which is N P L H as in no place like home, Mitch, all one word, N p l h mitch@gmail.com. Happy to take questions there if somebody isn't comfortable on Facebook. So yeah, we'll see you next Thursday at three o'clock Eastern. Right back here in the studio or wherever you get your podcasts.

Raylene Meunier (30:59):
That's right. Or wherever you get your podcasts.

Mitch Bernard (31:01):
Okay. Now you get to watch me figure out what to do here. Ooh, stop streaming. Okay. Bye.